What happened: A few weeks ago, while on holidays, the engine started cutting out on me after a few minutes of running. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Buy two or three sets. Lest you run into what you are finding.Next is to replace the spark plugs. Why? Stay tuned! Any advice on the plugs will be awesome. These sensors (which includes the coolant temperature and MAP sensors) receive a 5-volt source and ground. These wires are necessary so they can't be removed like the spare wires mentioned above. I am experiencing a faulty TPS which may be due to RFI. I called them to see what the next step is and I get the best news. Super informative, fast shipping, and so far a 5/5 experience! I've always thought that Sniper resetting was due to wiring or RFI noise, but today we proved that wrong. You're proof that it can be done. The car generally ran well without the air cleaner but the moment the air cleaner was lowered to the top of the throttle body, BAM, it shut off like you'd hit the key. Good find! Called Holley after checking everything. They are a couple of bucks each, right? You must log in or register to reply here. Atypical RF sources can be even stronger and have more deterministic effect on the ECU than the typical ones. Have tuner now still runs very rich, have to run open loop to get home, runs pretty good. Two months later I get an email saying my ECU was definitely toast. If you have done the steps above then you likely will never have any problem with RF interference. An ungrounded plate tends to reflect it-- sometimes right down into the ECU. 12-10-2020, 03:06 PM. In this first picture you see a quick blip of the throttle (light green trace) and the resulting increase in RPM. They aren't that expensive and there is absolutely no down side to keeping a spare TPS in the glove box if that's not the problem. Then you'll get an outstanding product. That being the case, RFI/EMI will pass through the cap itself whether it has a hole in it or not. I tried Holley but didn't get much, so I thought I'd try Chris but knowing he owed me nothing.Well let me say he responded to my questions and concerns quickly, read some of my datalogs and provided some great advice. Last ditch effort. Turns out he did. Thank you very much for this article. But since the factory can't know how long wires you might need they tend to make them too long. Checked again, when I ground the white trigger wire to the HyperSpark box, I do get a spark. I did the Holley distributor as well. How would the bad sniper cause damage to the internals of the engine? But the primary goal has to be the prevention of RFI. Hi Chris, I recently had a sniper system installed on my 55 nomad with gm zz4 350. In fact, the magnetic pickup is so susceptible that I recommend using a hall effect sensor (such as in the Holley HyperSpark Distributor) when practical. To nice to throw away but it hangs on the wall as a reminder to not do that again Well good luck with it. The first thing to realize is that RF interference can manifest itself in ways that will have you suspecting and replacing everything in the system. RFI still present when new alternator is hooked up. That is understandable, because there may be absolutely no other indication. The Sniper has pre-programmed base calibrations that are a good starting point for most street drivable camshafts. The best practice is to take these management practices into consideration during the installation process, before RFI becomes a problem. Called Holley after checking everything. Based on those I've helped it appears that a few Sniper EFI Systems are shipping with ECU firmware version 1.0.17. Increased gaps increase spark resistance, causing energy to be emitted from the plug wires. In the case of the magnetic pickup (more accurately referred to as a varible reluctor or VR), this susceptibility is compounded by the fact that many do not recognize that the sensor must be tuned to the environment. So don't waste any more time on that. That's because the ECU was seeing the same thing and flooding the engine because of the false RPM readings. I also believe you can contact Holley for troubleshooting as well. As much as I hate to admit it I myself was in RF signal denial. They told me I had RF problems that I failed to accept. If you don't have "Magnetic" selected as you rignition type then none of this applies to you. However, now that we have the Sniper. Ive also fully separated the power circuit from all other wiring up to the fuse block, and separated and insulated all EFI wires present in the engine bay. Instead of fixing the problem, we leave the problem in place and go on the defense, trying to cover up wires, ECUs, and sensors that might be affected by RF energy. There are a couple of things that you can do that are relatively easy and might give you some solid leads on the problem. That arcing will result in EMI. Put a capacitor on the output cable. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. So he did. Same. He said Holley said it will work and they have thousand out there to prove it. These often end up bundled up in the engine compartment. Even new wires occasionally have defects, and all it takes is one crack in the insulation for a wire to start arcing to the nearest grounded chunk of metal. I mentioned to the customer that he could be getting EMI from his alternator and he thought, "I know a quick way to check that--disconnect the alternator!" Just want to take a moment to thank Chris for all of the assistance during the timing control set-up of my Sniper installation. I have the progressive link kit installed that I bought originally from you. Sand to bare, clean metal every mating surface between the alternator and the engine block. Car runs perfect now!!!!! It is simply amazing how much EMI an alternator can produce. Right through their front window. What is the engine? A couple of options for getting one. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. They're sending me a new Sniper free of charge, plus free shipping back to Canada. If you datalog the Sniper ECU and see multiple overlapping traces for the same signal, you likely have RF-induced problems. All rights reserved. In the case of our Project Shop Truck with cast iron Vortec heads, GM recommends the ACDelco R44LTS6 gapped at 0.060 inches.On the point of gap I'm going to rebel a bit for the initial start-up. If you have "Magnetic" selected as your ignition type then you will see a place to set the MSV. On the other hand, low-powered signals (like the Wideband O2 sensor), signals that generate their own power (like the magnetic pickup in a distributor), and resistance-based sensors (like the Throttle Position Sensor) can be terribly corrupted by RF energy. . That's generally a good thing. Ignition coils can begin to break down internally, doing so gradually so that the engine will still run (particularly at idle.) check out the. Like my biz as a repairman, I see. - Verify Wiring - ECU must be powered and grounded directly at the battery and the battery is fully charged. Just received my package from Holley today, it's complete with everything not just the throttle body. check out the. I believe that thinking of this as the "air cleaner issue" is what makes this problem a bit misleading. EFI System Pro had everything I needed for my EFI upgrade. Im running msd street fire wire set. "Hey, you don't happen to have an electric fan coming on at about 185 degrees, do you?" Well, first off, you are perceptive in noting that anything that increases resistance on the the plugs can lead to spark energy going where you do not intend for it to go. That's why I am not a big fan of increasing spark gap.But the in-coil arcing you are experiencing doesn't sound right to me either. Because they are easier to purchase than the Magnecor my favor is leaning in their direction. Installed a Sniper EFI kit onto a freshly rebuilt Pontiac 400 and was trouble free for the first 100 miles. All times are GMT-6. You'll simply have to buy them direct if you're interested. You said there was metal in the oil how would that be caused by the injection? You are using an out of date browser. The air cleaner can act as an antenna too and it sends whatever it picks up straight into the throttle body, or it can make it worse. and our 100% of the time and without variation. The O2 sensor is not a passive sensor that simply sends back data. Let's see how long it'll take from Memphis, TN over to Bowling Green, KY. Yep, same situation around here. That's why USPS (United States Postal Service) is called "snail mail". A grounded plate tends to absorb RFI into the ground plane. Shielding is really taking the wrong approach. Oh no that is horrible. Strongly recommend. Unfortunately, it is not currently possible to change the MSV from the handheld. Very rare but when that happens you need to stop feeding it O2 sensors at maybe number 3 or 4 (not number 7) and send the unit back to be checked. ago I read something where that has something to do with the MAP sensor. The msd I was using was I dont know how old. RF Interference is an unavoidable enemy to successful EFI operation so it must be carefully and thoughtfully managed. Why? If you think your throttle position sensor is failing, working some of the time and other times it is registering negative percent, my first suspicion: RF Interference. The most typical culprits are the spark plug and coil wires. #1 Sniper Setup Wizard Failure Fix 06-20-2018, 01:26 PM I'm finding that several Sniper EFI Systems customers are getting to the end of their Setup Wizard process and getting a message that says that the file necessary to complete the configuration can't be found. Maybe it was like that before the sniper? I found my problem. And when you do it can seem like nothing is working right. "But you don't understand, My spark plug wires are brand XYZ, the best on the planet, and for that matter they are brand new!" They key is to be persistent and solve the problem, preferably by identifying and removing the source of RFI. Price Point: $$$. How did you fix the problem? It just takes diligence. 1 8 comments Top Add a Comment IxuntouchblexI 8 mo. Have seen it. I would be trying to talk the customer into some kind of nice carburetor. Ensure the Crank Signal Positive / Negative wires (Purple and Green) are twisted snugly together the entire length of their run. They gave me a test for the ECU, and my Sniper failed the test. Alternatively, you can cut a section out of the middle, strip/solder/heat-shrink the pair down to a reasonable length. This fan is an atypical source of RFI. We offer a spare wire removal kit for just this purpose. The Sniper was resetting so often that we couldn't do any work. I look at the data log and noted that every time the engine got to 184 degrees it lit up with RFI. If you had precise electrical measuring equipment it could be done but that is far beyond what almost anyone has. Just don't trust their application guide--be sure to specify the length of each wire in your set. Not a bad idea and definitely worth a try but so much of this is trial and error. Any information is GREATLY appreciated. Full product line and accessories at excellent pricing. P/n6420 Note also that there is a "Filtering" selection that can be toggled between "Low" and "High". This last section is only for those who are doing ECU-controlled ignition timing with their Sniper ECU. The first thing to do is key the system on, wait about five seconds so that the TPS zero's, and then press the throttle to the floor and watch the TPS. I have seen cases where the ECU gains an appetite for eating O2 sensors. I used the tip of checking for arcing in the dark and bingo I can see white light between the epoxy-sealed body and metal casing on my MSD HVC Blaster coil. The AFR trace on all my data logs since February have looked the same, new install. For more information, please see our The first thing you should do when you suspect that you have RF interference is to double-down on all of the best practices that are given in the installation manual regarding wiring. We used to sell thousands of dollars of these spark plug wires a year until I found them too difficult to deal with. Get a new alternator. Start with the factory-recommended spark plug. ago Its in an 85 there isnt a map sensor, holley snipers take over completley. Last summer, a faulty ECU in my Holley Sniper EFI took out my 1972 Ford Mustang, bringing it into early storage for winter. Update: MSD's Super Conductor wires are lower resistance than I like to see but I'm not hearing of anyone who has has RFI problems after installing a new set of those. Robust, feature-rich multi-port EFI systems offer easy plug-and-play late-model V8 engine swaps. Holley did a warranty on it and I have it back The best advice I could give is don't be in denial. In your 7-pin harness, you will be either using the yellow or the purple wire for RPM input. Recently I received a data log from a customer who said that his car starting misbehaving when it got warm. I discovered it back in the mid 1980s. Holley sent me a UPS postage sticker for free delivery from Canada to Bowling Green. My only issue as present is some misfiring popping through the throttle body. I have had others with similar "alternator-related" problems that never got it solved, even after changing the alternator multiple times and cleaning every connection. Now, read on to get a deeper understanding of the problem. He directed me to a few articles and I'm just about done with the set-up after getting what was most likely RF Interference issues sorted out. If that gets out of alignment you will have a fireworks show going on under the cap and never even know it. This should help prevent the problem from happening further. At that point, if I do anything that creates RFI then its an easy matter to back up.A final word on plugs not related to RFI. Problem gone. Parcel arrived today and I installed the repaired Sniper straight away. But I wanted to know if grounding the cleaner might solve the problem? Gap the plugs to the manufacturer-recommended gap and if you are running big compression or boost you will have to either increase your ignition power or CLOSE the gap to compensate. I wasn't going to mention this because it's probably not the problem. Sometimes it's as simple as just changing a boot on a plug wire. Pricing was reasonable, shipping was prompt and Chris helped me with a wiring question during my install. Tony from the Holley forum thinks it might be the ECU.Thanks for any help. my 186,000 mile SC400 is boring..gas, oil, filters and tires..still has its original O2 sensors! Problem is not the alternator. I have a similar problem with the sniper and hyperspark on a 68 Chrysler 300. Went to back the car out of the shop one day and it would not idle for anything. The first response I typically see to telling someone they have RFI/EMI issues is denial. This despite having a quality brand of plug and coil wires that were well-routed. What works on one setup can cause problems on another. If they don't seem too bad then use the smallest bit of dielectric (silicone) grease just on the area where the boot engages the ceramic. I"m going to gap down to 0.35 to 0.45. The ECU firmware is in with the software download (. Strictly speaking, it's an RFI issue. Connect the msd to a separate battery including the power trigger wire. As a last resort, I'd try reflashing the ECU firmware. And finally, if your engine is stalling completely at random and nothing else really makes sense, then you might have RF interference issues. Sniper ECU and Handheld Firmware Versions, http://forums.holley.com/showthread.2193#post72193, If this is your first visit, be sure to The injectors usually fire when grounded, so if you had a grounded harness, it could possibly cause the injector to go open. I tried looking this up to no avail and am in desperate need to fix this as Ive spent 8 months on this project just to get halted at the last lap. While it was gone out I ordered the hyperspark ignition box from u and will be starting the set up and tuning shortly. *Possible delays due to Covid-19 click for more information. The Internet know-it-alls will tell you to open the gap up to get more power. When you are inspecting/installing your cap and rotor, pay particular attention to the tab on top of the rotor and the button in the center of the cap. When I start the car and try to rev the engine the TPS goes to 35% but no further. :-). Last ditch effort, i sent the entire unit back to Holley for testing. With the advent of EFI systems like the Sniper EFI System more and more of the details formerly left to the installer are being completed at the factory to provide a "plug and play" experience. Sure it is. ECU Failure, Replaced, No Charges. Terminator X Max 700R4 LS2 L92 heads and LS3 525hp cam and Jim Inglese 8 stack fuel injection. If it were then grounding it would solve the problem. ive done dozens of these things and have one where air cleaner goes down bam she dies. But the failure tends to be deterministic, not random. Cookie Notice Thanks Chris for the feed back regarding my rough running sniper/timing issue even though I bought my sniper through Holley. Doubt it? Cheers. In my experience the far majority of Sniper EFI customers never have a problem with radio frequency / electro-magnetic interference (RFI/EMI). For example, on our shop truck our spark plug wires go immediately down and straight under the manifold to the spark plugs. I have a holley sniper put in my big block and been screwing around trying to upgrade the firmware. Use a clean white cloth and wipe inside of the cap. However, I. I read a clean RPM signal on the handheld and in the datalogs. Trust me, nothing would make me happier that to loose my **** at this point but im gonna keep it together for now what was in the filter? Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Keep up the great work Chris, I'm sold! For those who want to understand VR sensors in a bit more detail, this is an excellent article. Solving RF Interference Issues in Sniper Installations. When we say, "They just don't make them like they used to", we generally mean something is not as good as it used to be. Getting what I think is false lean readings. So, a second quick check is to disable the alternator (preferrably by removing the belt). This page was generated at 09:18 PM. Whever someone has an RFI problem they always start by explaining the effort they have made to separate their wires from each other. Non-update update: DHL & USPS managed to take 13 days to get the parcel from Frankfurt Airport to Memphis, TN. Privacy Policy. Take the alternator belt off and all is good. All times are GMT-6. Even if it acts properly when powered off you might want to just get a new TPS and try it. Reddit, Inc. 2023. I swapped from a Edelbrock 750 and a Carter mechanical pump. Seems the Sniper should have a fail safe if it sees the rail pressure drop with an RPM (NONE) mismatch..Dont know how smart they are but that's a safety feature from high pressure pump EFI day 1: no CPS RPM detected, no fuel pump relay power after 2-3 seconds. One is to get the vehicle somewhere it is as close to pitch dark as possible. Invariably, this is the user that, after weeks of frustration, replaces the wires on out of sheer frustration and finds that it solves the problem. The pin removal tool mentioned in the section above can be used to remove these pins from the 7-pin connector on the Sniper main harness. I recommend setting this to 0.35v initially and then increasing to 0.5 and then 0.65 if that does not resolve your RF problems. MSD 6AL. And before you put the plug wires back on, inspect the boots very carefully. If the oil thinned, perhaps it didnt do any damage as you only had it running a low RPM for what maybe 5-6 minutes? Thought I'd post this because of all the problems guys have with ECU problems. In early November I was having a problem starting my car with the Sniper. To do this will require downloading the Holley Sniper Software. If your distributor is old then recognize that it could be rotating in a non-concentric manner. The throttle body itself is generally fairly well grounded when bolted into place so, by extension, so are the air cleaner plates. This instruction manual must be read and fully understood before beginning installation.
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